Christian Solorzano [01:11]

Hello, you're listening to Underscore, a show by the Chicago Graphic Design Club. I am your host, Christian Solorzano, and on today's episode, I'm delighted to share my conversation with designer, Robert Robbins. Together, we explore his journey from skateboarding culture to creative leadership and how these experiences have shaped his approach to mentoring the next generation of designers. Robert shares his perspective on creating spaces where creativity can flourish and why vulnerability is essential in leadership.

He speaks about his connection to Chicago's creative community From the early days in the punk rock scene to his current role as creative director at City Church Chicago, where he's fostering an environment of growth and possibility. He opens up about navigating career transitions, finding strength through serving others, and how these experiences have shaped both his creative practice and his approach to building teams. His story is one of resilience, authenticity, and the power of community and service work.

This is our final episode of 2024, and it's an inspiring conversation about finding your voice and helping others find theirs. I hope you enjoy it. And also, I want to say thank you for listening to Underscore in this 2024 year. Enjoy the conversation, and I'll see you in 2025.

Robert Robbins [02:46]

Enjoy.

Christian Solorzano [02:47]

Hey, Rob, how are you doing? Nice to see you again. It's been, it's been like 2 weeks since we last talked.

Robert Robbins [02:59]

Yeah, time flies, man. It's good to see you. Good to be here, especially in this season. It is like jamming. So it's— we just finished Scrooge, big production, like huge turnouts. And so that just ended. And we're rolling in, prepping to be off for 2 weeks. So I am, I am ready.

Christian Solorzano [03:24]

And this is going to be our final episode of 2024. And it's also our Christmas Eve episode.

Robert Robbins [03:33]

Yes, I like to be Eve times 2. Eve times 2. Eve to the squared.

Christian Solorzano [03:41]

So for the listener, I want to have you introduce yourself a little bit, but for those of you listening that don't know, your most recent involvement with the Chicago Graphic Design Club was your co-authorship on the Back to Basics books— Back to Basics book that you worked on with our mutual friend, Sean Fermoyle. So that's how you and I came into contact with one another. And since then, we've connected a handful of times. And I like to think that we're becoming friends, if not already friends.

Robert Robbins [04:23]

Yeah, totally. Besides the Morrissey connection, right? So yeah, having the book be the bridge is kind of cool because it literally was a bridge from me still being out west when we started that. But yeah, my name is Robert Robbins. You people that know me through print call me Robert. People that know me from way back will call me Rob, and those friends of those friends end up calling me Rob. So either one is acceptable. No Bill, no Bob, no Willie. None of that. Robert works.

So yeah, the book, being out west, son hit me up and saying, hey, I got this. Let's do a book on getting back to the basics. At that time I was making a big shift in my career path, and he was like, you're kind of going through this. It might be interesting to— he's like, and I've been through it a ton, so it might be interesting for us to write from our point of view.

Having been through multiple versions of that over different points in our career, to write about it and kind of speak to those that are at our level and those that are just leaving school, entering into that level, and put in a little few tips and tricks and plus our little personality in it.

So it was kind of cool to wrap that up while I was out there, me making a choice between a few things and then land kind of like a dream scenario of starting a new studio and then, and also getting like kind of a dream gig that would bring me back home to Chicago.

Christian Solorzano [06:32]

Yeah. So can you, can you tell us a little bit about your introduction into the world of design, creativity, photography, arts. I know you, you've had a diverse background when it comes to like all the different mediums that you've practiced over the years. I want to understand sort of everything that led up to you and what you're doing today.

Robert Robbins [06:56]

That would have to be I guess I would really attribute it to skateboarding because that introduced me to the 2 things that I started doing when I was like, 8 or 9 years old that I'm still doing today, photography and design. And so it was like introduced me to photography perspectives, breaking the rules when it comes to that image and storytelling.

And then graphics and how just things that were graphic relate to motion and then how type was used in, typography and letterforms and just kind of, dismantled and reconfigured into things. I'm like just sketching that stuff constantly. And yeah, so that was that's probably huge. I had those tendencies even younger, getting grounded from like using all the film up in my parents' camera, making stories like stop-motion booklets that I had no idea they were stop-motion.

I just, there was no video camera around, so I was taking stills of scenes that I was creating in my parents' basement. But Seeing it in a publication that identified with a core, activity that kind of put me on a trajectory in my life, like skateboarding, it was like, wow, people, this is a real thing. People get paid to do this stuff. And yeah, and that solidified like there was a path.

Christian Solorzano [08:49]

Yeah. Skateboarding is such a gateway into graphic design or into many things. Music, design, photography, a lot of stuff, like good and bad, I feel.

Robert Robbins [09:00]

Well, that's what my parents, because, skulls are there, snakes are there. My parents are like, what is this? And I'm like, oh no, Mom, it's just, it doesn't— it's just something that's cool, like pirates and ninjas, whatever. But it was used in a way like, I don't know if I want my son like Running around with, skulls all over everything.

And so trying to find stuff that was like fitting of, so then it was like flaming swords because Tommy Guerrero, he had— he didn't have skulls, but he had like swords. So I was like, okay, I could skate the Guerrero deck. And he happened to be a street skater. So it's kind of like it took me down, even a more specific path.

Because then he could be an idol of mine that was accepted in the house. So, and Mike McGill, maybe not, because it was like a skull with a snake going through its eyeball? It's like, but just drawing that. And then of course, the things that were just bizarre, like the screaming hand from Santa Cruz and Speed Wheels and stuff. So I would draw that. All the time, and they had like just different things.

I'm getting remember they used to have this like bust of like it was a woman's body like with it was like no arms, no legs, whatever. It was just like literally a bust. It was like one of the icons that they used in their like sticker kit or something. I remember drawing it in at school. They were like. Why are you drawing this with a woman without a head? What's wrong with you?

It was like, didn't— I had no idea because I'm not thinking what they're thinking, but I'm just literally a young kid who's like learning how to replicate what I'm seeing and drawing what I'm seeing and trying to hone, then creating my own things out of that. Yeah, totally innocent, totally pure.

Christian Solorzano [11:08]

Were you a troublemaker?

Robert Robbins [11:09]

I was a— I was a straight-edge kid, so Totally not a troublemaker. It was funny because, being in that crowd at that, at that age during that time, it was like seen as a rebellion to sports because there's no like quote unquote team, which was funny because I was always pursuing creating skateboard teams and it wasn't something that I necessarily looked at being alone doing. But I wasn't— I never— I've never drank or smoked in my entire life.

Still to this day, at my age, I haven't had alcohol or cigarettes or taken any drugs of any kind. So I was never that and was never interested in that because I saw that adjacent to me, the kid that was trying to do skate and he's drunk and he's wiping out and I'm like, that's repulsive to me. And it He smells horrible. And, so I was like, no, I want to smell good, look good, whatever, because the girls are watching, whatever.

So just, I would say I wasn't a rule follower, like so I got, I got more in trouble for things that were like normal boy stuff, hanging out way past curfew, maybe losing track of time because I'm skating in a scene or we're building a ramp somewhere and it's, just not paying attention in class or goofing off or class clowning. That's the most troublemaker. It's like me getting a laugh out of— so yeah.

Christian Solorzano [13:01]

I used to get in trouble for my hair and it's like stuff that today, like if someone said that about a kid's hair, they would, you could not do that. You cannot comment on someone's hair.

Robert Robbins [13:15]

No. Yeah, because their hair is their identity now. Yeah, I, yeah, I got sent home from here, I think, once before, like a pink slip. He needs a haircut or whatever. Yeah, just those are so funny. I like legalistic things. Back then that they were concerned about. It's like, how about looking at his grades? Oh, he gets great grades. Oh, he doesn't get in trouble for any of these other things. Meanwhile, people that were pointing their finger at me, their kids are getting arrested for DUI.

Their kids are getting pregnant in high school. Oh my God. And I'm just Why? How am I the evil one here when I'm like, not getting in any of that mess? I had a goal to get out of that town too. So it was like, I had goals that they needed to be achieved.

Christian Solorzano [14:16]

So talk to us about your— so you're not originally from Chicago, but you're based in Chicago now. And when we last spoke, your story was fascinating.

Robert Robbins [14:28]

Yeah, so yeah, my mom and I are from— we're from California, LA, and my dad died when I was young and her remarrying, we ended up getting a taste of the Midwest because we moved out here when I was young. And so that, in getting into my teens and coming into closer to the city and stuff, I got a taste of Chicago and—

And then after college, I went back to California and realized pretty quickly that, the film industry was just not my jam, probably. I was not into every day being Monday in order to survive and be film world, and it was really difficult. So in trying to get like a book of my poems published at the time, my friend had sent me some seed money to get this publication going.

And it came at the time where I had come to my, like the end of my rope kind of in LA. And I asked her if I could use the money to get out of Dodge. So she was like, yeah, whatever you need to do. So I took that money, packed 2 bags of clothes, and flew to Chicago because on the sets that I was in, I— the people that I really connected with were from Chicago and New York.

So that was— I'm like, okay, where am I gonna go? And I got about $300, and back then the plane ticket was like, whatever, I forget. But I landed, so I flipped the coin and Chicago won the coin toss. I'm like, okay, Chicago it is, because I had contacts in both places. So Chicago it is. And literally by the time I landed in Chicago. I got dropped off at Belmont and Clark January 16th.

I don't know the exact year, but I was in my mid-20s, early 20s, and I had $8.50 in my pocket, 2 bags of clothes, no winter stuff except a punk rock leather jacket with studs all over it, and the patches and things. You can just imagine. And a phone number to my contact. And so that began my Chicago experience, literally. I didn't know it, but I was only blocks from where he was. He had a shop that was right next to the Metro, Calvary Metro.

So he was running a— trying to run a shop out of there that sold a lot of Kozik stuff. A lot of Daniel Haas prints and a lot of artwork that was done by Rob Zombie and Marilyn Manson. And so it was like one of those pop art shops, and he was publishing like underground comics and materials and stuff like that. So I literally landed, met with him, and then we're working on this punk rock zine. All night long.

So that was my intro to my life that would be the next 25 years or so in Chicago, was that energy, that hustle, that, wow, we're making this thing and we're FedExing it out, and then we're eating at this Mexican spot at 2:00 AM. And then we crashed for 3 hours. The next— now we're like, I'm getting introduced to the photographer who works at Camera de Metro. And so it was just that was heroin for me. It's like, I was like addicted.

I'm like, I'm in this, I'm gonna do this. So I was like, yeah, Chicago, this is my place. This is home now. And so I quickly just settled into that, into that kind of like city of big shoulders, doing, working hard creating art, just and watching the fruits of those labors.

Christian Solorzano [19:10]

Yeah.

And coming here as, coming to, coming to a new city and being, much younger than you are today, like how what was, what was it like to find your voice or how'd you, I don't know if you've ever felt whether it's like imposter syndrome or like doubts or like insecurities, but I know a thing that comes up a lot for designers in particular is just this lack of identity or this lack of like belief in yourself or like you're capable of doing the things that you were doing?

So how do you, where do you draw that, courage to just go to a new city, to flip a coin? That seemed, that might, to some people, that may seem like such a daunting thing and doing it with less than $10 in your pocket. That's like a movie scene.

Robert Robbins [20:07]

Yeah, it's, I am wired to be an entrepreneur and take huge risks. So I think, throwing yourself into cement and concrete as a skateboard thing was like— but it just taking that risk continuously and getting up after you're hurt, those things you learn in life. But one of the things I said to somebody today when they were kind of stressed about like, oh my gosh, I don't have Enough prepared for this thing today. And I was like, you know what the coolest thing about that is?

No one else in that room that's showing up, they don't know what you don't— what. They have no idea. So they're probably going to think it's amazing. So that's the other thing that I learned really quickly. It was like, you know I came into this, it was like, man, I don't have like the structured background that graphic designers had, but I'm making stuff in the punk rock kind of way.

It was, in the skateboard way, it was like making things by hand and putting it together and photocopying it and then rearranging it. And so seeing flyers and things that I was making to communicate to people and having them not know who I was, not know anything about it, but hearing people be like, oh, did you see that thing? It was so cool. This is awesome.

And they're like talking about they've pinned it to their wall and stuff and they're collecting these flyers that come out every month. And they had no idea that like, quote unquote, graduate from design school, like that's not who they're talking about. They're talking about a photographer who's found his way through communicating things and is teaching himself how to do that. That stuff is making these things that they're collecting, that they're in school or graduate school for.

They didn't know any of that. So it's like the things that keep ourselves from doing stuff is usually coming from within and those people were like encouraging because they were loving it. So it's like they don't know what went into it and they didn't know the lack that I had.

So all they saw was the final piece and what was good at it. So I think having that encouragement on the streets, so I think it's really just like doing it, it's just really to do it on a, initially small scale. Make the thing, put it, I mean, nowadays it's different because it's digital, it's immediate.

And see, but it's like for back then it was like make the thing and put it, a stack of them in a coffee shop. And then, Sean could relate to this because we'd be like, let's make 2 versions and see which one people like better.

Like put them next to each other. And if one went faster, it's like, oh, they like this kind of design for this thing. So it was just like being able to test, use the coffee shop kind of thing was a great advantage. So nowadays, having a digital platform, getting immediate feedback, being able to post something and be like, hey everybody, what do you think?

Christian Solorzano [23:50]

You know?

Robert Robbins [23:51]

Yeah. That's awesome because, maybe stay off of Reddit, but, your community is most likely going to be encouraging instead of wanting to tear you apart right away. So I think that's where it came from was just partly nature, not defiance, but there's a rule breaker thing in me, like a challenge. I like to challenge. I like to— if I see something, I'm like, but I can do that.

Why not try it? So I think pressing into those things instead of saying, oh, I can't do that, that's too— that's too amazing. It's like, no, like you've been created to be like who you are. Own it, live in that. Your audience is out there. This world is so huge. That's the other thing was finding out like my— there's an audience out there for the things that I love, I can literally create for myself and find an audience of people that are like-minded.

Who want to celebrate the thing that I'm also into.

Christian Solorzano [25:16]

When you and I were talking, you were talking to me about how you used to work at the Alley in Chicago.

When I was younger and I was like, living in my little bubble of like just teenage angst. And for like the first time that I stepped into that store and realizing that there is other people that were into the same things that I was into, it was such a relief. It was like one of those moments where you just feel like you how do I say it? Like you're validated?

Robert Robbins [25:52]

Yeah.

Christian Solorzano [25:53]

It's like I've been confirmed that, you see, Mom, like there's other people like me. It's like, it's not just, it's not just me and my computer. And that, and I think that's why community and like kinship is so important is because having that common stewardship over a thing is so critical. And even just like speaking with you and like speaking with a lot of the guests that we've had over the years, it's so it's so great to just have this reciprocity.

Robert Robbins [26:24]

It's your, it's your language and press into it. It's you having that desire to make that thing, that is your language. Press into your language, whether it's graphic design whether it's collage or whatever, but something that you find yourself just naturally doing, that, that's your own language. And there are other people that speak that language. Press into that, push that, challenge, get uncomfortable in that. By pressing it out there.

Because when you find someone else, like you mentioned, stepping into the alley, you're like, wow, there are others there. There are— no matter how niche you think you are, there are others. There's nothing new under the sun. There are others that are looking for you to make that thing that they can also then be connected to.

Christian Solorzano [27:17]

Yeah. When I, when I first went to the alley I was like, damn, there's people that are weirder than I am. I still like, to me, those like moments are such character-defining like milestones that you just like never forget. So I want to know a little bit about the work that you're doing today.

Robert Robbins [27:37]

So there's a lot of things. I mean, I didn't mention it much last time. You might have heard rumors of it, but this week we're filing an LLC on a new studio called Egg! E-G-G exclamation point. And there's a couple paragraphs we're finishing for the website, but it is a narrative brand, a narrative branding studio. Also started from being out west and what am I going to be doing?

And it was just kind of like 3 guys that have been working together over the years, kind of like getting together and just saying, let's start something. If the world doesn't accept you, start your own thing? And that's— and then you find others like we just talked about that are like, no, I'm into this too. So that's starting. And then so in starting that, I was like, I need to find a way back to Chicago.

And one of the things that I tell, that I tell other people that are in business or people that like I'm, that I am their mentor for design or whatever, if you can build the thing, with someone else's money, do that. So if you're on the job and you have an idea, test that idea with some— someone else's money. Approach your boss, approach the owner of that company, pitch that thing. If you can create a business with someone else's money, do that.

It's a great way to test your entrepreneurial skills. So if that being my, life mantra, getting the thing paid for, I was like, well, I'll get to Chicago through a job or some kind of thing or whatever. And having that mindset, I just literally started packing up my apartment without having a place to go to, just knowing like, I'm going no matter what. It's like, I'm not flipping a coin this time. I'm not leaving everything behind, but I'm going back home to Chicago.

I'm going to pursue this thing. Yeah. And then literally like 2 weeks later, I get a phone call and it's from a friend at City Church Chicago that I had helped build the media team prior to me going out west for 7 years and building a studio out there. Prior to doing that, I built a media team and taught film, photo, and design with them as a volunteer.

And then when I left, so I was out there in Pacific Northwest for 7 years and making this decision. They had been talking about the growth that they were going through and my name was coming up from back in the day. And so I got a phone call and they were like, hey, what are you up to? And I'm like, well, I just start— I'm starting this new thing and I'm looking to come back to Chicago. And they were like, you are really?

You're looking to come back? Okay, well, and I'm like, well, what's going on? Which— what's, what, what's happened? Is everything cool? And they're like, yeah, we've just been talking about you a lot. And well, what's the story? What do you— and they're like, well, we need, we need— I'm like, you need me? You need me to come back? What do you need me to send you something? What do you need from me?

And they're just I got to go back to this meeting and let them know that you're interested. Because in the meeting, it was like, being a little tired of my name popping up. Pastor Kett here was like, can somebody just go call Robert and see what he's doing?

So when the phrase was, I'm looking to come back to Chicago, they quickly had an offer put together for a creative director position to come and to strengthen team and build team and overhaul the brand and get it and build— kind of the goal is to build like an agency that will serve and teach and grow like all the— not just the church here, but all the outreach things that they do. They do a lot of things in the community.

So it's like it's more fast-paced than any agency I've ever been in. So for those that like to design and create, it's like the place to go and learn. Like it's a boot camp for graphic designers, it's a boot camp for videographers, it's a boot camp for copywriters. Like it's fast-paced, it moves. So those that are— that like to work that way and have an opportunity to like literally reinvent every season 'cause things are seasonal.

It's like a really fun gig to have to be flexing that creative muscle on the daily. So, and creating rules around how do you transition? It's not like, how do we create this brand for the next 15 to 20 years? It's like, how do we do that and have it be an anchor, but also have it be able to transition and be cohesive from season to season and from event to event and theme to theme?

Christian Solorzano [33:33]

Yeah.

Robert Robbins [33:35]

So that's what I'm doing now. If I listed all the things, you'd probably— next question would be like, when do you sleep?

Christian Solorzano [33:43]

Walk us through a day in the life of you.

Robert Robbins [33:45]

I'm a night owl, so I'm trying to make a few adjustments, but I'm usually like in the gym by 8:30 and I'm close. Yeah, 8:30 AM. And then I'm here at the offices at City Church Chicago by 10, and we kind of run like 10 to 4. And then after 4, it's like focused on the other creative endeavors, egg and personal projects and stuff. So that runs like Monday through Thursday.

So then I have, Friday All day and Saturday that I focus on like street photography or egg projects or, getting other things going up. I'm foreshadowing, like you misspoke and said books. Yes, maybe there's some more books. There's another book coming, yeah. But just all those other creative things. What do you do for fun? I work. I literally love what I do. Being able to be blessed to leverage my skill set that pays my bills is the best thing, and to come to be applying that.

And teaching, and having— we have creative nights here every once in a while, so we do that as well. But that's my day. It's like 10 to 4. It's like meetings and directing the needs for the communication. Obviously, you can imagine, in an organization that has a ton of outreach, happening and communication is going out constantly. So there's a huge need for that, like copy, video, and design. There's— and the interesting part, like a big portion of it is run on volunteers.

So these are working professionals. A lot of them are in school. Shout out to the Columbia crew. There's quite a few. Columbia students that are here. But it's a very— I think because of the location as well, it's a huge creative community that happens to be here. We just put on a full-blown production of Scrooge and set design, fabrication, like everything's volunteer. It was insane. So it's just like just being around creatives like 24/7. So, and having a great office space to do it.

So yeah, that's my Monday through Thursday. And then Fridays are, the mornings maybe are a little more lax, but it's, it's— I'm working on projects all the time and— And then when I'm not, then I'm feeding the creative tank by absorbing, film, photo, art installations, seeing what the latest Chicago Graphic Design Club thing is into. Keeping in touch with my community.

Whether it's design, photography, art, or film. So I'm in groups and meeting other people that are creating stuff and trying to make things happen here in Chicago.

Christian Solorzano [37:34]

So you strike me as a person that tends to be pretty optimistic and hopeful and like just kind of possibility. You strike me as someone that has an abundance mindset as opposed to poverty mindset. You see opportunities, you see possibilities, and then you roll up your sleeves and you get it done.

But I'm curious if you ever deal with the gloom and doom that sometimes takes over, many creatives, especially just living in today's changing world where there's so much polarization and, just uncertainty about the future, our industry, politics, division, so much, nastiness at times. How do you, how do you cope? And then maybe what's your solution or your offering to someone that might be listening that maybe can't find an opportunity, find a job, maybe someone that just feels like they're kind of in the dump?

Robert Robbins [38:44]

I've had, I grew up with a good family life. But I've had a difficult life. I've lost absolutely everything I own. Twice because of being an entrepreneur. So I've had weeks of where my breakfast was Grape-Nuts, strawberry jam, and water. I couldn't afford milk. So I've been in those places. I've been through those times. And so when I speak to this, it's like I'm on the other side of that.

And I literally came out of probably, everything has context and perspective to it, but it's a choice of perspective that I choose to take. I came out of one of the— probably one of the most difficult 18 months maybe that I've had, and coming back home was like, tears of joy.

But building something like the studio that I did with the group out there, I thought like I was setting myself up for the rest of my life, even though ideally the location wasn't where I wanted to be, but I could imagine like this amazing life and things were extremely successful. The financial roadmap was incredibly bright and to have it disappear, just poof, was shocking.

And then to discover that Oh, nobody wants you because you're of a certain age and you're of a certain gender and you're of a certain whatever. You had your time, basically was the thing that was coming back. And not legally spoken, but like on the down low from other HR people, they're just kind of like, you're done, bro. You're like, good luck. Put on the orange jumper and go to Home Depot. It's like, but so I went through all of that.

And so, but it was like literally, I grew up having a very strong— my faith has always been something that's like evident and relational, and it's proven itself to me. Over and over and over. There's too many stories of things that have happened to me where I've like literally have had— I don't know how I'm going to pay something.

And then somebody will come up to me and be like, hey, you helped me with that thing a long time ago, and I know you were just doing it for free, but it's done well for me and I just feel like I want to pay you. And literally in that moment, receiving that like $300 Covering my bill, my food for that getting me through that gap.

It's just like you know having being steadfast and having fortitude of just like I'm choosing to move forward because I don't accept going backwards. Like I just I just that's something that I just have. Made a choice. And the thing is, it's not easy. It's easy to say it's a choice, but it is.

And so when you determine to make a choice of your perspective being that sound right there is breath in your lungs, you being able to see things in front of you being able to have dexterity, you being able to move, to walk, to do like Those things are a lot more than what a lot of people have in this world already.

And choosing to shift your perspective into, I am capable of making something out of nothing, like I'm literally capable of seeing a need that someone has and fulfilling that need. So in shifting my, what could have been depression into like just volunteering and serving my like taking my skill and use it to serve someone else. All those volunteer things, let me just help you out, let me just do this for you.

Oh, here's how you, whether it's consulting someone, like a business owner that I knew or whatever, they're like, hey, that paid off, I want to give you money. Or, that business owner knowing like I'm cranking on something and they call up like, hey, are you Are you guys working on stuff? I'm like, yeah. And then food just shows up. Just those things, have always happened in my life.

Or, one time when I literally lost everything and I was crashing on somebody's couch and trying to get the business back going, somebody's like, do you have an office? I'm like, no, I don't. I'm sorry, but I can meet you at a coffee shop. They're like, no. I have office space for you. So then boom, I had office downtown Chicago where most businesses weren't able to even afford to be. I was operating downtown.

So because I was choosing to have my focus in something else other than myself and what I was feeling and pressing into that and just moving forward, it's like and then the other aspect of that is like, well, what can I do today? So it's breaking that down into like, well, today I can do these 5 things. And that is forward momentum and progress. Because the daunting thing is like, if your goal is to find a job that day, that's daunting.

But if your goal is to like, hit these 5 job sites and make something creative for yourself and then maybe make a piece of art that you share with 5 other people and have a conversation like that fills your day with so much positivity. That just keeps generating like a cyclical thing of like those things create momentum in your life, like propel you forward through those dark times.

Christian Solorzano [45:25]

Yeah. And I, and I've read, and I've experienced this myself, that doing like just being of service tends to generate happiness and joy. And it just, it, I've never once done like a positive, good deed where I've been like, damn, I shouldn't, I regret doing that. Or like, oh man, that like totally ruined my day.

Or like, it's always like just this perpetual motion where you feel like you're kind of in harmony with something, whatever you want to call it, when you're just not getting in the way of yourself, which I feel like that tends to be for me. Anytime I kind of trip over myself is usually when I fall into like a pit of despair.

Robert Robbins [46:19]

I mean, being a poet, being a creative, it's like, oh, when the night comes, that's when the silence comes in and your mind tends to want, it's like, yeah, wow, those are the danger moments, right? Those are the Morrissey moments, the Smith moments, watch out. But it's really difficult when you're serving someone else to be thinking about yourself. It's almost impossible.

It's like so, and when you have removed self From— for an extended period of time, that's whether it's an hour, maybe you shoveled your neighbor's sidewalk, that's never shoveled yours, but it's like, I'm just gonna do this 5 feet for that guy, he's grumpy or whatever, I'm gonna like— Just like those little things, it's like you walk out and it's just so freeing and it unlocks things.

Christian Solorzano [47:19]

And it requires that you have some kind of faith that it's gonna work. And don't— and kind of like to not get too in your head about it or too intellectual or try to rationalize things. Because I think sometimes as designers, we try to have so much certainty about things.

Robert Robbins [47:40]

Oh yeah, we like grids and defined things. Yes. What are the parameters? Where's the brief?

Christian Solorzano [47:47]

And sometimes that certainty is so, in my opinion, like it's so limiting and it kind of, it's like kind of having blinders on. For me, that's— Some people need the certainty, but in my lived experience, it's always been like the ambiguity and mystery of things sometimes leads to surprise. And usually that surprise is a very welcome surprise as opposed to Trying to force something to happen.

Robert Robbins [48:17]

It's a good exercise to be in for sure. It expands your mind and your thoughts because, I mean, thank God not everything depends on me. Oh my gosh, what kind of world would that be? Horrible. I could only do several things, really well.

Christian Solorzano [48:40]

So what's— so what would be your call to action for people that are in a leadership position where they can sort of guide and mentor the next generation? So for example, with you working with your team at City Church, how do you cultivate and foster that space where there's psychological safety to make mistakes, to ask questions that are on everyone's mind. How do you cultivate that space?

Robert Robbins [49:16]

Yeah, that's one of the things where I knew coming back here, as with any organization going through COVID especially, the staff was like a third, and coming— I know I'm coming into a space where I was here in the heyday, so it's like, you know my nickname was Big Fish back then because they had a— they— that was what they were calling me before they met me, like trying to corner me because they needed help back then. And I had all this gear.

I was like popping into service and then popping back out because I was working up the street on a job. So I knew that coming in that I was gonna have probably other leaders that were gonna be nervous about this guy coming back in? And then I was gonna be entering a place where nobody knew anything about me. And knowing that things are fast-paced, I needed everybody to be in alignment with where we're moving and be in alignment with change.

What I tell other leaders, is you need to have the bravery to be vulnerable. And if you can be brave enough to be vulnerable with your team and recognize that humility is not a weakness but a strength, that they'll rally around you and you can build a culture of trust more quickly. That it usually takes years to do. You can build a team that trusts each other really quickly if you build a space where you're brave enough to be vulnerable, they'll be vulnerable.

And in sharing those things is very human. And especially post-COVID thing where we were like forced to be separate from each other, like the walls are thick. There is a quiet that has come over our nation in a very weird way where you put groups of people together, nobody's talking. Hey, what's the idea? And I know that there are amazing ideas in the room, but nobody's speaking because that was shut down for a long period of time. And as humans, we're meant to be in community.

That's how we're designed. So that's my big thing is just like be Brave enough to be vulnerable. And then, and in doing that, there's a safety that's created. And then having multiple, like a practical thing on the leadership side is having multiple avenues for people to be able to submit ideas. Because, we all know in meetings you've got the other, the people that are super vocal and the people that probably are the most brilliant tend to be a little quiet.

You need to have a space for them where they are able to like drop their bombs. And whether that's in Slack or Milanote, we love— I love Milanote, dropping their creative things in Milanote to share and getting that feedback. And then also letting people know that it's not their work. That I'm looking for, but it's the relationship. So whether they're doing great work or a lot of work or any work, if they're creative, they're a part of this team.

They're welcome to be here, whether they have capacity, to volunteer or do anything. I'm not concerned with that. I'm concerned about building community and being in relation with other creatives. So that's— the value is in them just being present and being a part. I had a mentor tell me, Robert, I don't think you realize that before you physically enter a room, your presence already enters. And think about the weight that comes with that. When your team knows that there's a meeting coming.

My, the status that the corporation has put on me as creative director of the studio, and I'm walking in to critique like a week of work that carries a lot of weight because those people, whatever they're going through, Their family's in crisis, whatever. I don't know what that is, and I, I'm open to knowing all of that.

But sometimes you don't know what people are going through, and knowing the weight that your presence brings to a room, to a situation, and trying as best you can to displace that so that you're just being present for that person and whatever they need in that moment, meeting them where they're at in life, in work, in that project is key.

Christian Solorzano [54:43]

So we're almost at time, but I have a few quick questions for you. What are your favorite spots in Chicago? Do you have a— when you're not at City Church, when you're not at home, where can people find you?

Robert Robbins [54:58]

My fa— I'm in the streets. I'm literally in the streets with my Nikon Z9. I know it's ridiculous to have that as a street photography piece of gear, but I'm running around with that beast of a camera and I'll go all day. I will walk and walk and walk all day. So I'm in the streets, I'm shooting like the spaces between.

So if you were to ask me, I want to learn how to take photographs, whatever, that's the first thing I would say. Shoot the spaces between. And go think about that and define what that is for you, and then I'll give you what my perception of what that means.

But the spaces between. And Sean and I joke about, there's a book coming called that, and, it's like Photography over my lifetime maybe. But so, but typically you'll see maybe a little architecture, but it's usually the human interaction. It's the, you know portrait here and there that is totally street photographer style. And then sometimes there's somebody that's just engaging with you.

And I'm just let's go, you know what I mean? So it's like Might have a little fashion shoot, like just impromptu, whatever. As, my comfort level has grown in that.

Christian Solorzano [56:24]

But are there any specific neighborhoods or areas in Chicago that you like to go to?

Robert Robbins [56:30]

It's funny, like I would never live downtown, but I love being downtown in that, in all of that to see where different artists are trying to make their mark in such a big place, whether it's like, murals or, graffiti or, and the different fashion and things like that. It's like, people are fascinating to me. So it's like, and the light that plays down there is great.

Christian Solorzano [57:02]

But yeah.

Robert Robbins [57:02]

And then I would say some of my favorite neighborhoods, I mean, I was in Wicker Park for so long, and it's changed so much. But there's still little portions of it that I love, and I'm in Logan Square now. There's parts of that I love, and I've lived all over the city. For that 25 years that I was here, so there's aspects where I'm literally all over the place.

Like I gotta go up to Lincoln's Lincoln Square and hit you know the butcher shop up there, and yeah. The little German markets, and there's a bookstore up there that I love. But just sometimes just being on the train, riding it, and getting that perspective. So the subway I love, and the different interactions with people and sifting through neighborhoods. And then, my other love is just Lake Shore Drive.

Christian Solorzano [58:05]

So very nice. Next question what are you currently listening to? What's usually playing?

Robert Robbins [58:13]

I would say almost like, probably because it's like crazy time, like it's just ending, so I'm coming out of it, but I was listening to the band Washed Out like for a solid week every day, like in the car here, back home, like because it's so chill, but it's got a great beat. And that was like perfect for the little bit of chaos that I was in. I was listening to the band Washed Out. And then—

And of course, there's, today, this morning was Tears for Fears. It's like, hey Siri, play Tears for Fears. So it's like you get some nostalgia?

Christian Solorzano [58:59]

All right, next question. Do you have any guilty pleasures? What's something that you're you, you'd be kind of ashamed to admit?

Robert Robbins [59:06]

Billie Eilish.

Christian Solorzano [59:07]

Billie Eilish. I was watching her that is a guilty pleasure.

Robert Robbins [59:14]

People would not ever know. I can't believe I just said that. But it's like you said it so quick.

Christian Solorzano [59:21]

You were, you were eating things twice.

Robert Robbins [59:25]

Yes, it's funny. People be like, you listen to her? I'm like, yeah, I— it's funny, there's nothing else like it on my entire library.

Christian Solorzano [59:35]

But, yeah, I mean, she's good. I was watching her she did a show for NPR's Tiny Desk, and she's very talented. She has a great voice.

Robert Robbins [59:46]

Yeah, her brother is amazing. Them as a duo, if they stopped, I think the magic is in that musically. That's my guilty pleasure.

Christian Solorzano [59:58]

And then last question is, what is bringing you lots of joy today? What's making you really happy?

Robert Robbins [60:06]

It's making me really happy. Oh, man. Mentoring. So I have an amazing team that is growing here and watching them make something that suddenly 1,000 people see on the weekend and they get immediate feedback. They're like, I'm in my career right now and I'm not even out of school. I'm like, yes, you are. So mentoring just— it's— It is so Fun. And it's a huge responsibility, of course. But that brings me the most joy.

Is being in a crew because I get to mentor designers, I get to mentor illustrators, photographers, filmmakers, like the whole team. And for them to be sitting at a table and we're having a debate about something, and in my mind I know they're gonna lose because I'm gonna— about to bring some wisdom, and perspective. But to hear their ideas and just let them go and go and go, and then be like, have you thought about this?

And they all go, oh my God, yeah, okay, I see, I see, to unblock those things. And then, and then the next week they bring something back that just blows my mind. And I'm like, oh man, you took what I did and went way past? So it's just that is— it makes me young, it keeps me young, and I never want to not be doing that aspect of my career.

Christian Solorzano [61:53]

And do you notice any trends or anything in particular that, for example, younger generation of designers are like coming in with like Questions? What's something that you tend to hear a lot of, if any, if anything?

Robert Robbins [62:09]

Yeah, I think especially, it's like some of the stuff we touched on earlier. Are they going to be okay? So are they going to be okay? Is what they're doing silly? Because some of their parents are telling them that. And I'm like, hey, I'm not here to put down anybody's parents. But I'll tell you right now, they're wrong because you were made to do this.

And to deny what you were created to do. And I will tell you, if you need to shift your career, don't— yeah, I'm not, Mr. Rogers. I will, and I will help them make that shift and be like, you know what, I see you as this. And if you're interested, go study that. If you're interested, I can help create a path. For you to go into that and how their creativity can be fed in that. It's just they don't see that.

And I can share my story of starting out and where I am now and how those paths, it were— there's zigzag up and down all over the place, but always in the creative industry. And there is a way because as a people, we're visual. As a people, we're storytellers, and it needs to be communicated. So there is a place for all of it, and there's a place for them.

Christian Solorzano [63:37]

And well, it was a joy to speak with you, to learn more about you. And I love your passion and your enthusiasm and your positivity. And so thank you, thank you for sharing that with me and thank you for sharing it with everyone else that's listening.

Robert Robbins [63:58]

Yeah. Thank you for the Chicago Graphic Design Club. I love that, you're doing it and it just brings me a lot of joy and hope that you're helping the old school be connected with the new school coming up and fostering that community. And I'm here for it all. So whatever I can do. Whoever's listening to this, I'm here for you. You can connect with me. I'm very approachable.

And don't let the sound of what you think is busy deter you from connecting with me because I will make time. I have time for sure. Yep.

Christian Solorzano [64:38]

Sounds good. And I'll put your contact information in the description for this episode.

Robert Robbins [64:42]

Perfect. Cool. All right.

Christian Solorzano [64:45]

But with that said, I look forward to staying in touch and running into you and hanging out and for more collaborations or involvement with the Chicago Graphic Design Club. So thank you for being our last episode of 2024 and also being episode number 70.

Robert Robbins [65:04]

Happy holidays, everyone. Happy new year. Yeah. All right, man. Later.

Christian Solorzano [65:09]

And that wraps up 2024's Underscore podcast. We look forward to more conversations in 2025. Thank you so much for tuning in this year. And as always, to learn more about the show, visit www.chicagographicdesign.club. And I would really appreciate it if you left the show a rating wherever you listen, Spotify or Apple Podcasts or anywhere else. Thank you and talk to you soon. Happy holidays. Happy New Year. Goodbye.