Christian Solorzano [00:01]

Hello, you are listening to Underscore, a show by the Chicago Graphic Design Club. I am your host, Christian Solorzano, and on today's episode, I have the pleasure of speaking with Suzie Shin, a designer and an artist, and most recently an educator. She's teaching typography at DePaul University here in Chicago, and she's going to be talking to us about her migration to Chicago.

A few years ago, and she's also going to be talking to us about the upcoming exhibition that she's working alongside Rick Valicenti, who is our mutual mentor and friend and who introduced the both of us to each other. And she's going to be sharing some of that work. So this episode will include some visual information. So make sure that you are watching either on YouTube or on Spotify or anywhere else that allows podcasts to it's a great episode.

It's a great conversation, full of laughter, full of stories, and full of everything that we love about design, craft, type, color theory, and so much more. So as always, we really appreciate you tuning in. To learn more about us, visit www.chicagographicdesign.club. And if you enjoy conversations like this, we really appreciate you listening and giving us a review on iTunes.

Suzie Shin [01:28]

Yeah, definitely.

Christian Solorzano [01:32]

Rating wherever you are streaming this. So thank you and enjoy the conversation. What's up, Suzie?

Suzie Shin [01:42]

Hey, Christian.

Christian Solorzano [01:43]

How's it going?

Suzie Shin [01:45]

Good. Feeling good.

Christian Solorzano [01:47]

Great. I like that we recently met. This is like a new— what I would consider the beginning of a friendship. We were connected by Rick Valicenti, who's a mutual friend of ours. And when we met in person a few weeks ago, you mentioned that you did some volunteer work for AIGA Chicago a few years ago. And I'm pretty sure you and I ran into each other many times because I feel like we've definitely been in the same circle.

Suzie Shin [02:20]

Yeah. And we've also, we're also teaching.

Christian Solorzano [02:24]

And we're also teaching at DePaul, which is really cool. And I, and I remember someone told me that you were teaching at DePaul, but I didn't know who you were. So I looked it up and I saw that you're teaching typography, which is really cool. And you're like a new teacher. You're still fresh.

Suzie Shin [02:46]

Totally fresh.

Christian Solorzano [02:47]

And how's that been going?

Suzie Shin [02:51]

Oh man, I think what is very similar to a personal practice and teaching is that you're thinking about it all the time.

And I enjoy that actually. Like when I'm in a regular job, it's kind of hard for me to draw those boundaries. But with teaching, you're just always kind of like mulling over what would be a fun assignment, what would I tweak from last time. So, I have a little notebook that I've been Putting together homework things, which from a student's perspective, they're probably like, no, but for me, I'm like, they're gonna do a lot of work.

Christian Solorzano [03:29]

And what's your do you, how do you, I'm curious about how you feel after class is over. Do you feel good when class is done? Like after, like for me, I'll give you my example, but, and it doesn't matter if I go into class like in a bad mood because of work or anything that happened in the day. After class, I'm always just so— I feel, I just feel so happy and fulfilled. Like I made, like I made some kind of difference.

And I'm curious about what your experience is.

Suzie Shin [04:03]

Honestly, I think because it's— I just finished my first class. My thought is probably, oh, the energy was great that class. So I'm feeling really good about it. But then if it wasn't, then I'm it's been in the back of my head again of like, I wonder how to better engage, or maybe there was something off about today's activities.

So I think I maybe still haven't felt that yet because I'm trying to feel really good about the material, but that might take me probably another like year or so to keep working on it.

Christian Solorzano [04:37]

Do you, do you do a lot of preparing before class?

Suzie Shin [04:42]

I think it's mostly, it's a lot of the thinking. So maybe something after class, like I feel lots of relief. I'm like, yeah, you got another like week at the most until next class. But then it's always just the thinking, the thinking. And then I feel like most prep is in there. And then once I'm, once I feel like I'm in a good place with that, I have some good ideas, then it's like the doing. Doesn't take that much.

Still overall, it takes up a lot of my day, but like quietly in an invisible way.

Christian Solorzano [05:18]

Yeah. Have you ever just winged a class? Like you just like don't have any plan, just show up and you're just all right, we're gonna see what happens today.

Suzie Shin [05:26]

I'm not that experienced yet. No, I'm not on that level. I would, I feel like even if I did do that, I'd have a plan for how I'd wing it. So Type a is maybe what you'd call me.

Christian Solorzano [05:41]

So. Yeah, there's been a few instances where I've like, just cuz of life things, I've just all right, I'm not super prepared today, but I know what I'm gonna talk about. And usually those classes where I'm like the least prepared are always like my favorite classes.

Suzie Shin [05:58]

So you don't ever tell them, no, today I'm winging it?

Christian Solorzano [06:01]

No, but I suppose if any of them, any of my students are listening to this, they'll now know that sometimes I do that. So I want to talk about your background. I really love when we met a while ago, a few weeks ago, you gave me these really beautiful postcards. Yeah. And I love Your use of color and like your compositions and everything feels very analog and counter-digital.

Like we're so used to digital everything and it feels nice to see something up close that has some detail and like a soul to it. So can we talk about your introduction or how you got into design?

Suzie Shin [06:49]

Yeah.

Christian Solorzano [06:50]

Can we talk about that? Do you have a recollection of your first encounter with visual something?

Suzie Shin [06:58]

Yeah, actually, I've been— I was one of those like art kids. Like I always— I was drawing for as long as I remember. I probably thought at one point I'd be like a fashion designer illustrator. Like I think when I was a kid, but into high school. I was really interested in illustration. So I went to RISD thinking that I would be in the illustration major. But the first year at RISD is like a foundation year, so no one declares a major.

And at that point, I felt like, if I'm here at art school, which is such a gift, I should learn something I have no idea about. And I was like, okay, graphic design. Intrigues me, so let's go for it. But once I was in there, I remember my sophomore year, I was like, I chose the wrong— I chose the wrong major.

This isn't me. I felt like I was copying other designers, and I just didn't know how to find my own voice in design. And it wasn't until I took a color class with my Professor Suzie Cousins. It's funny because her name is also Suzie, no E at the end. But in that class, she had us do a sketchbook and create our own paste papers, our own collages, and also make like posters that kind of play upon that practice of collage. And I was totally blown away.

There is a world where some designers aren't just Swiss designers. Yeah, there's so much like life and color and play. And that's when I saw artists like Sister Corita Kent, which she totally blew me away as well. So much joy and whimsy and like that organic feeling of the looseness. And then I, then I felt, okay, I can really see myself growing in this way.

So ever since that class as a sophomore, I've been collaging and working in that thread because it feels most true to me.

Christian Solorzano [09:15]

And you mentioned being into illustration. What did you— what were the things that you illustrated?

Suzie Shin [09:22]

Yeah, I thought because I like to draw, I was like, okay, then I should be a children's Book illustrator. I mean, that's, I think, what you imagine when you're like 17, 18. I'll draw things for magazines or just be known for my drawings. And I still do draw, which is nice. And I've since also been exposed to artists like Ellsworth Kelly, who did collage, he did sculptures, he did paintings, and he also drew. He has these lovely like botanical pencil or pen drawings.

So, I've just found that like most designers and artists I love also drew and painted but they didn't have to call themselves an illustrator or a designer or an architect only. Like they just— they did as they pleased. I do think there's almost too much defining in the Art world today, maybe.

Christian Solorzano [10:22]

Yeah. And it's nice that I feel like that when it comes to graphic design, there's this like misconception that all graphic designers know how to draw. And in your case, it's true.

Suzie Shin [10:33]

Yeah. Honestly, if, yeah, if I were to be very honest, like typography is still something that's hard for me to have my heart go to. Like I'd much rather go towards lean on like the illustration side of it than the type. So if my students are listening to that one knowing that I teach type, then that, that'll be a hard one.

Christian Solorzano [10:59]

What is it about type that like has— makes you have those feelings?

Suzie Shin [11:03]

I think, I think something about type that still feels intimidating is just how much typography is out there. It feels like every project you have this opportunity to choose from a billion typefaces. And then it's always, oh, how do you do it? And it's fun to explore, but at the same time, there are so many other elements to consider, like the composition and color and hierarchy. And then you can almost get stuck in looking for the right typeface for yeah. Maybe the rest of your life.

Christian Solorzano [11:43]

Yeah. Yeah. Most recent, like this year I discovered justification settings in InDesign. Which I never knew about. And I can't like not think about that from now on.

Suzie Shin [11:57]

Yeah. Has Rick gave you his like magic justification numbers?

Christian Solorzano [12:02]

Yeah, of course. I have them written. I have a notebook of just all of his numbers and all his information. But yeah, typography is to me, I, when I was in college, I felt like you needed to understand, you need to be like a master at typography to just be a designer. And obviously, I'm nowhere near that. But you sometimes, I feel like when you see really well done typography, at least for me, it just, it's so humbling because you're just damn it. Yeah.

Suzie Shin [12:40]

No, I saw a lot of amazing details in the magazine that you were working on with Rick. So a lot of that type felt super delicate, which was nice.

Christian Solorzano [12:48]

Yeah, and it feels so good when you get it right. You can just— you could go to sleep at night and you could have like your— you just have pure serenity because you know that your type is good.

Suzie Shin [13:00]

Yeah, I once designed the some signage for a coffee shop I designed for in Orlando. And the signage is just the name. It says like Han Coffee. But when they installed the letters, they kerned them too tight. And if I was there in person, I would have said like, hey, like loosen it up? But yeah, I wasn't. And now it's forever too tight. And I think that does haunt me. Many nights.

Christian Solorzano [13:30]

I saw Justin Bieber just came out. I'm not a fan. I don't have any feelings with Justin Bieber. But I saw his album cover.

Suzie Shin [13:40]

I know what you're gonna say.

Christian Solorzano [13:42]

Yeah, it's called Swag and like the kerning with the W and the a is just like atrocious.

Suzie Shin [13:49]

It's really bad. It's like the SW and then the AG almost. It's like that was intentional.

Christian Solorzano [13:59]

Yeah. Yes. You can't—

Suzie Shin [14:01]

I know. The 1975 is also like that, just to add.

Christian Solorzano [14:07]

Okay. Yeah, there's a Justin Bieber one. And then also the Pope's when he passed away, the kerning on his, on his marker.

Suzie Shin [14:17]

Oh my gosh.

Christian Solorzano [14:19]

I probably need to fact check that, but it was pretty bad from what I remember.

Suzie Shin [14:25]

It's tough.

Christian Solorzano [14:26]

But anyways, so going back to you. You're teaching typography. You're like a new educator at DePaul University. And like I mentioned in the beginning, you and I, we were orbiting around the same circles like years ago. And you, you're originally from Florida, right?

Suzie Shin [14:46]

Yeah.

Christian Solorzano [14:46]

Then you went to RISD and then you came to Chicago. And because you wanted to work here and you felt like you needed to live here to be able to work here, if I remember correctly. Okay, so can you walk us through that first impression of coming to Chicago for the— just coming to Chicago?

Suzie Shin [15:11]

Oh, I think when I was growing up in Florida, I've always dreamt about being in a city. And when I visited Chicago, it was gorgeous. The sun was reflecting on the water and it was glittering and I'm like, yeah, I could definitely be here.

I also love the winter actually, so that's not an issue for me. But just the, just the idea that like a city would have so many small design studios that are doing really amazing things, like that was super shocking to me. Also because in Florida everything is really far from each other. You want to go to your friend's house, it's like a 45-minute drive away.

So you're like, I'm— I can't go to my friend's house. But here there is like Thirst and Studio Blue and Some Odd Pilot and like all those studios are probably only like a couple of miles away from each other, just to name a few. Bright Great, like so many exciting places for young designers to dream about. And yeah, I think at that time you would've killed to have an internship anywhere.

Christian Solorzano [16:25]

Yeah. And then your method was to, you mentioned that you went to Thirst and you brought like physical stuff, right?

Suzie Shin [16:34]

Yes. Okay. So I am a little pushy and that, that's a good thing and a bad thing in some ways. But I do think for looking for jobs and opportunities, it was a good thing.

I tried to find out any kind of connection that I could. So, anyone who's lived in Chicago who had any connection to RISD, I tried to say, hey, I'd love to meet up, show you my work, get, feedback. So, I met a lot of people that way. I also did send, physical mail to studios, like letters and samples of my work and I did like cold calls, cold emails, and specifically for Thirst, I had, I had visited.

And then since I was able to visit multiple times, I was able to share like, oh, here was what I did for my senior thesis. So I sent that thesis. Like a little box with a couple of items and a booklet over to Bud Rodecker. So I don't know what he did with it. He should have tossed it at this point, but I think I was hoping to make an impression that way.

Christian Solorzano [17:47]

Yeah. Yeah. I always tell younger people to be pushy.

Suzie Shin [17:54]

To show them. You totally. Yeah.

Christian Solorzano [17:56]

And I feel like sending an email is like, it's everyone's sending an email. Yeah. That's cool. So then you mentioned when you and I chatted a while ago you mentioned that you went to Thirst many times, but like nothing came of it. And then one day you were working at AIGA events and Rick walked in and you finally met him like in person. And he said—

And he said he sent you to Columbus, Indiana to have like spend a weekend there. And that turned into a book, My Weekend in Columbus. Cool. Can you talk to us about that?

Suzie Shin [18:39]

Yeah. So at that point, I had, I had pestered Bud a lot. I've been to the studio multiple times. The first time I'm like, oh, I just love feedback on my work. Please let me know if there are any internships. Then I kept asking over time, I would love to intern here, love to intern here. And he just kept saying there wasn't an opportunity at that time.

So then when I was at that AIGA event, I finally did get to meet Rick and I think Bud was there and was like, this is Suzie, she's come by and pestered us. And yeah, I just had all this like energy because I was so stoked to see him.

And he was like, I don't remember what he said. I'll have to ask to see if he remembers, but I think we shook hands and he's like, come by the studio. So I was like, I will again. I'm gonna bring like all my stuff, like bring my sketchbooks that I had from studying abroad in Italy as a junior. So I had all these drawings and paintings and kind of a callback to my love of doing those kind of things aside from graphic design.

And yeah, on that spot he was like, I'm going to send you to this place called Columbus, Indiana. I don't know what that is, but I mean, some fast and fun facts about Columbus: it's an hour south of Indianapolis, it's considered an architectural mecca. I think in terms of rankings, it's like 6th in the world, which is very random to think about that this, small Midwest city is going up against places like New York or Boston or even Chicago.

So, I got to go and it was really like an opportunity of a lifetime and Rick gave me so much confidence. Which I think is very hard to do if you're working with a young designer. You'd probably want to keep them low and then build them up slowly. But the type of person Rick is, he'll just blast you all the way to the top and then try to support you to keep going.

Christian Solorzano [20:54]

Yeah. Yeah. And then with Columbus, Indiana, most recently, you have been working with Rick on an exhibition that opens up on the 14th of August and the opening reception is on the 16th of August, which is a Saturday. I'm like surprising myself with all these like numbers.

Suzie Shin [21:15]

I also thought it was on the 14th, but it seems like the opening is the 15th. So I do have to get back to you. No, I probably told you the 14th because that was on my documents too. Okay.

Christian Solorzano [21:28]

Anyway, so that's coming up and that's on— can you tell us a little bit about that exhibition? Because you shared with me some of the ideas and some of the visuals that you've been putting together. And I've been telling, I've been trying to paint a picture for the people that I'm trying to get to come with me.

Suzie Shin [21:44]

Yes, absolutely. I can give like a quick overview and then actually I could just share some images because I think that's also more fun to tell the story. But Rick and I have been working on this since the beginning of the year, so actually not too long. And it's called Alexander Girard Reverberations Forever. We just landed that name yesterday.

So Rick and I both invited 6 artists each. So including ourselves, we have 14 contemporary works that are going to be in this show. And then something that's really special is that we're borrowing or having things on loan, Alexander Girard's work from the community.

So like in so many people's homes in Columbus, they just have like a Girard panel that's in their house, or like they have like one of his dolls in storage, and they're almost just kind of sitting there, maybe, even getting some like water damage or something like that. And now we're able to collect them all and kind of tell this story about how Girard's influence has reverberated and echoed into modern design now. So, let me share and I'm just going to pop over to that page.

This is the quick overview, a little bit of recap of what we talked about. This is one of the sketchbook spreads that I had from my time in Italy that I brought to Rick. Oh, wow. Saw. And then he's like, all right, I want you to go to Columbus where they were having an event called Exhibit Columbus, which is an event that happens every 2 years. And the city then invites architects and designers to do temporary installation. So this was happening at that time.

So Rick said, I want you to go and draw these temporary installations and we'll make it into a book. And you'll intern at Thirst. So I was like, this is my dream come true. So these are some of those installations of that time. And then on the right, you'll see like my drawings and the little booklet. It's like very small. It's like that.

Example of these tiles that are painted coming out into this like multi-panel page. And then at that time, so this is 2017. I was in the Solomons County Library. I forget the official name of that, but I was meeting the archivist, Tricia Gilson, and she had pulled these samples of Alexander Girard's textiles. These are his, color samples.

I forget actually, because I didn't annotate at that time where these were from, but I just remember being so struck by the fun in his color and just also the subtlety and just how easy these kind of palettes were on the eye. So, I remember this from like 2017 and since then, Girard has been one of my favorite designers and artists. He's made a pretty big impact on certainly how I see color. These are just some quick things.

After I started working at Thirst and interning, I was able to help with designing these bus graphics. And now if you go to Columbus, you will see like these crazy C-pattern buses. But that's more of kind of a general Columbus story thing. But some previews of the things that'll be in this small gallery. So we have a lot of— we do have a lot of these kind of installations or framed works and things in different mediums. A preview from Present Future Architects.

These were initially designed folded papers and then having no paper waste at all, and then those were cut into wood and then painted, and they will— they'll be arranged on this cool plinth, and then people will also be able to take away a paper to cut it themselves at home. So that'll be really fun. Present Future Architects, they're an architect studio in Chicago. We have clocks. We will be displaying 2 from the practice called Manual, which is the work of Creighton Berman.

And he's like continuing this clock series. So actually, when I, when I texted him, a photo of a clock in Columbus. He's like, I have the ideas for my next clocks to finish out the year. So I'm really excited to see what new clocks he'll have. We have a 3D-printed chess set from designer Jonathan Neshi, who has had a really big impact in Columbus, and he has like a practice there as well.

So we have this rendering and then this 3D-printed frame from UrbanLab, another architecture firm here in Chicago. And this is actually one of my works. So here on the left is a collage, and I used a vintage Life magazine because those have such beautiful, large printed ads. So they're such a great pull for color. And I really like this kind of gem tones against this tan. And this is probably like a yay-size small collage.

So I'm— was working on this to become a much larger print. I think this one's 30 by 40 inches. How do you translate something that was done by hand now into something that has almost like mathematical exactness and symmetry to it. How do you still keep the spirit of something that was done spontaneously into something that's now into like vector shapes?

So it's interesting to have to put logic to something after you make it. But I actually think that's a really big part of how I like to work in graphic design is that you feel it intuitively, and then you find out that logically it makes sense too. So that I'm always learning about how I work as I continue with these collages.

A little sample of a large print, and this is a typeface actually that was designed by Fabian Foerer, I think is how you say his last name. And this one's funny because Rick was like calling the printer and then having them print on a paper that they've never printed on before. It's like a photo backdrop, but he's like, yeah, just run it through.

So some people just have that much gravity that they'll tell like a large printing company to just to do something and to try it, and they'll do it. So I do want to be like Rick one day. So you never did it before? Well, you're going to do it now.

For me. And I just have a couple more slides here. My brother, he has a 3D printer in Florida, so he's printing out these like large letterforms for me. This one, this is a typeface designed by Juan Pantoja. And he is an Illinois-based designer. And he actually revived this typeface from Girard's La Fonda del Sol branding, which is very cool. That was never made into a typeface. And he's been working on this a really long time and an opportune thing. Hey, I'm working on this show.

Oh, you've been working on this typeface for a long time. Let's do something with it. So this is a small preview. It's going to be a lot of letters on a shelf, a couple of La Fonda del Sol's suns that are being printed and mounted to stand upright on the shelf. It's gonna be really delightful, I think. And then this last image is showing how Rick and I have been working, which is funny.

I think as graphic designers, when we're planning a show, maybe you think someone would know how to render the space, but we've been working flat like this and we just use the skew tool to just be like, okay, like that wall is receding and nothing is really exact and mathematical there. But I thought showing a sample of our work page would be fun.

Christian Solorzano [30:43]

Yeah, I love it. And I'm curious about, so like when you were talking about your recreating your piece with this, I think you said like mechanical precision or exactness. I would love to know like what your process of creating is, because to me, what I've gathered from like just looking through your work is that I imagine it must be very— it probably requires a lot of patience and just what, like internal, like reflection, or it just feels like very self-reflective.

I would say like that, that's my takeaway, just given that a lot of it has like analog feel. So I'd love to just Have you maybe walk us through your process of just ideating and like working with color and like composition and where that comes from?

Suzie Shin [31:32]

Yeah, I also do have some extra slides on that just in case we got on that topic. So I can share a little and then share some images. Okay. Something that I really strive for is first like having a plan and a vision and then trying to create the right circumstances for me to get into a flow state where my intuition is carrying out my vision.

So I think that sounds kind of abstract, but it— in the most simplest way, it means that I'll start— If this is for a client or if this is For something specific. I'll say, okay, what size paper or what proportion paper am I going to work with? Then I'll cut that. Maybe I'll cut a couple so I don't have to stop what I'm doing to go back and cut.

And then I'm like, okay, what's the color palette here? Is this something that's going to be black and white? Do I have any limitations with screen printing something? Because right now I'm working on something that's only a 4-color print. So, how do I do that? Or is it going to be printed digitally and I have no limitations? So, then I build what my rules are and then once I have those all set, I'm like, okay, now I can just go and explore.

So, it feels like I don't think anyone can really approach a blank page with nothing and then arrive yeah. Like majesty or perfection. I do believe in having a plan, but then probably trying to set yourself up in the best place to just let your instincts carry you.

And I think that's probably what I try to create with my students is trying to push, hey, you have to plan, but then now your planning is done and now you can. Don't know how— if I've been able to get there yet since it was only one quarter, but that is my— will be my longtime goal.

So, I did pull a couple of projects that I thought showed that fun play between things with the hand, now it becomes digital, now it's physical again. Some example here of working in a few colors, knowing that something is going to be 2-color riso printed for this calendar that I was designing with a friend named Jenice. So here we go from something that was done in paper. And I like to work in 100% scale if it's possible.

Obviously with larger things I work in proportion, but typically I like to do 100%. So that is like something where it doesn't have to get too digital. I'm just editing it to make sure it works well for print.

And here is another example of knowing that it'll be 2-color riso printed again, and then aiming for just a simple, black and white here, knowing that I'd probably bring in some gradients once it's printed in the future. So a lot of also what happens when I'm working in this way, it's so easy to do an image trace. Or clean it up and create exact shapes that mathematically are like perfect after I've made it by hand.

And moving forward on this one, this is an example where I knew it was going to be in black and white because everything for the New York Times Open, all the illustrations are black and white. So I look for a black and white photography book so that I would have a variety of textures.

And then once it came time to put in the actual images that the New York Times wanted me to put in, then it wasn't so big of a jump from my original intent. So that— I'll go back to here— is what it looks like as a feature image on an article. And you can stop me if I'm—

Christian Solorzano [35:39]

Yeah, no, this is great.

Suzie Shin [35:43]

And here's another one where obviously it was this piece was going to be too large for me to create at 100% scale, so I'm using it in proportion. And I knew that this one was going to be in stained glass. So in my head, I don't know how stained glass works, so I'm just imagining, okay, my shapes will probably have to be more angular, and then I probably won't be able to have much overlapping. Let's see what happens with this.

So the planning ended up that I needed to add these solder lines in between, and there couldn't be this like free open space that's on my design, but it still didn't mess with my intent, so I was totally fine with it. And of course, choosing colors and having it be actually produced, this is actually one of my favorite pieces.

Christian Solorzano [36:36]

That is so cool. I love like the reflection. Like on the ceiling.

Suzie Shin [36:40]

Yes. And this, I had a friend photograph that, Malachi Pearson. He is now based in New York. He was in Boston before, but he had brought lights to blast, like external lights to blast it up so he can get this image. He was, he was amazing for doing that.

Christian Solorzano [36:58]

Very cool.

Suzie Shin [36:59]

Yeah. I think I have maybe probably this last one for that coffee shop that I have designed for a few years now. These were going to be some really large-scale pieces, like spanning across the coffee shop. So I had originally made these like small ones. They were like this small, but I knew that they were going to be large. So I'm already thinking in that larger scale and planning like this.

And these ended up being then like vectorized and then printed on this like toothy Textured paper, so it feels like it was screen printed, and even though it was digitally printed. So an example of that here, I didn't even make those edges perfect because I knew that I was going to be recreating them later. This on the left was not going to be its final form.

So I've— Yeah, I have some extra pieces here that are like patching over what might have been another texture or something. But yeah, stepping from like here to here, I'd like to always seek out for the intent to be the same and also having that intent strongly in mind from the beginning.

Christian Solorzano [38:13]

Yeah. And do you— and do you think of your work as autobiographical? For example, these personal projects, or is it merely like visual experiment? What's your personal relationship to the work? Are you in the work or is it just you're just a producer and it's separate and once it's up, it's no longer a part of you? Or how are you emotionally connected to this?

Suzie Shin [38:43]

Yeah, that's a really fun question. Thanks for that question. I think since I've been Working out of college, I've made like quite a lot of projects that are not a part of this presentation, and I think that's probably what I'm seeking out as an artist.

I do— I don't think that something needs to scream my name if someone sees it, but I do think as long as I feel like it's authentically myself, I feel like a project has been a success. So I would say that all of these kind of projects that I've shown you and probably also everything that has been done for the Girard Show, I feel very personally connected to. And in a way that like, it's as simple as just feeling good about it.

Oh, I— that feels true to what I wanted. And maybe also thinking of Alexander Girard, is it delightful? Is it joyful? Is it warm? I know some design and some art has an intent perhaps to surprise you or maybe even to shock you. And I think probably my MO for my personal art is that it brings delight. I like that.

Christian Solorzano [40:20]

Yeah. 'Cause I do, I do, I do get the sense, like from looking at your work, it does feel very, it how do I, what word do I, yeah, it just feels very delightful and like very inviting. Like there's no, there's no, it's not harsh. It's not, it doesn't feel alarming. It feels very… Subtle, but in a very approachable way, if that, if that makes sense.

Suzie Shin [40:48]

Thank you so much.

Christian Solorzano [40:49]

Yeah, I like it. And I do, and I really love this image here showing like the, like the similarities, the similarities, but also some of the differences. Do you have a favorite?

Suzie Shin [41:04]

Of this?

Christian Solorzano [41:05]

Yeah, of these 2, you more into like the left?

Suzie Shin [41:09]

Oh yeah, I've never been asked. I think in a very designer way, I'd say I like how it became the one on the right, like the finished version, just because I know that I could never have arrived at this digital version, the one that was printed at a larger scale. I would have never created this starting from a digital place. There's just no way that I could sit down and be like, all right, gonna crack out like these 6 illustrations or prints or whatever.

They— I'd like to think that I think in collage. So maybe collage isn't the end goal for me. I'm not a collage artist, but maybe just an artist that primarily uses collage to think. So I'd say, yeah, the invisible in-between that happens between these images.

Christian Solorzano [42:14]

Yeah. And then, and then just going really far back, you mentioned that growing up you were into illustration, but what was the— was there something that you saw in your childhood growing up that made you— woke you up and just made you follow this path or all this stuff that you're doing?

Suzie Shin [42:36]

You mean like when I was like much younger?

Christian Solorzano [42:40]

Yeah, like before you were making anything or even knew that you were making something.

Suzie Shin [42:46]

Yeah, this is actually kind of a funny story. My— so I have 2 older siblings. I'm the youngest. And my mom has told us this interesting thing that she did. Moms need to keep their kids entertained. So in a mom's bag, you'll probably have a toy or a snack. And she said that she used to have— carry around just like pencils and paper.

And if we were somewhere at a restaurant or something and needed to quiet down, she'd get out the paper and start with a couple of doodles, and then she says, all right, now you keep drawing. So my mom's not an artist in this kind of visual way. I think she probably just wanted to keep us—

Calm. But she said my older sister was interested in drawing for a little bit and then stopped, and then my brother would rip holes in the paper and then he's like, all right, I'm not interested in that anymore. And for me, I just never stopped from that moment. And she would— I remember what she'd draw. She used to draw this grandma, this like crazy grandma with one line, which I thought was so interesting.

It was one connecting line of this grandma that had this open mouth, more like a flower, I think. And— I just thought that was so cool. So I really, I do owe it to my mom for starting that off for me.

Christian Solorzano [44:17]

Yeah. And then in another, was there ever anything else that you wanted to do or study?

Suzie Shin [44:22]

Actually, now I, after having seen my friends who majored in textiles, okay. And I, I've seen, I've seen so much like dynamic career paths come from textiles. Either people end up in sciences or they've ended up in fashion, or maybe it's like home goods design. You could work on developing shoes or clothing for space. Some of the textile artists I know are doing things that totally blow my mind.

Whereas I feel like almost every other major has funneled into graphic design. No matter what someone else did, I ask what they're doing now and they're like, I'm a graphic designer.

Christian Solorzano [45:10]

Yeah. And what are— yeah. And what are some— is that something that you want to get into at some point? Do you want to— like, you mentioned sculpture being also something that— you mentioned sculpture being something Alexander Girard did, but is that something that you would also like to explore sometime in the future? Anything else?

Suzie Shin [45:29]

Yeah, I, I'm actually learning how to sew right now and quilt because I do think my collages would translate really well into textile pieces. And yeah, Girard also, he led the textiles department at Herman Miller for over 20 years, and he designed all these incredible patterns. And colorways. So I do feel like in that thread there's a desire for me to see my work that's in something that's not paper.

And something that's more tactile. So I am learning how to do that. I'm like hand quilting right now and perhaps soon I'll be able to work on a machine.

Christian Solorzano [46:14]

So. Yeah, that's cool. And you also mentioned that you're taking class, like drawing classes, or you're taking some class, well, was it life drawing or what was it?

Suzie Shin [46:23]

Yeah, I have just— I dropped by the figure drawing classes. Yeah, it's in this— I forget the name— Platform Studios, actually. Maybe it's in the same building as Nick Press. Yeah, so I dropped by once so far, and I also— I just got some new like oil pastels so I can go back and do some more life drawing or figure drawing. Yeah, so I hope to bring that back since I loved doing that in college.

Christian Solorzano [46:51]

Yeah. So I'm curious about like when you're not making and creating, what are, what are the things that ground you and like just keep you intact? Because all this, all I like, all this stuff that you're showing us and that you're talking about, it's a lot of work and it just, it's just if you're not doing it, you're thinking about it. And it's just like nonstop. So how do you, how do you find that? Just what are the qualities or the things that make up you?

Suzie Shin [47:26]

Yeah.

Christian Solorzano [47:27]

Staying intact.

Suzie Shin [47:28]

Totally. You are right that I am thinking, either doing it or thinking about it. Another way to say that is that I do have some workaholic tendencies. Which I feel like a lot of designers have.

But I love to read. Reading is really big for me because I think it activates your brain in a different way than if I'm making something or thinking about making something, or even watching things. I love watching movies and getting inspired by visuals like that, but there's something about reading. I've been a lifelong reader and cooking is huge. My parents are restaurant owners and chefs, so I love cooking in silence.

I think because there's also— there's a lot of similarities between making art and cooking, such as knowing what you're going to make and then preparing the ingredients and then just like following the flow of what you need to do in the right time. Actually, that color, that color class I took that changed my life, Suzie Cousins, she was a restaurateur. So she was a chef before she became an educator and a book arts artist.

So I would say certainly reading, cooking, and then lastly, because a lot of design activity is sitting. I have had to start working out at the gym, which I've hated for a very long time, but I've come to appreciate needing to do an activity that's so difficult that that's all you think about.

So it gives me a bit of that pause in my brain to not be planning or worrying or like scheduling or trying to figure out like a solution to a problem in design. I'm really— I'm just thinking, can I do this next push-up or not? So, right now I'd say it's a good mix of those things.

Christian Solorzano [49:40]

I hate push-ups.

Suzie Shin [49:41]

They're really— I can do like 1.5 now.

Christian Solorzano [49:45]

Okay. That's good.

Suzie Shin [49:48]

They're really bad.

Christian Solorzano [49:51]

So, reading. What do you read? What are you into reading?

Suzie Shin [49:56]

I'm in a book club with some friends, and every time the book is selected by the person who's hosting on that night. So I've read a lot of different things, and I like that practice of getting out of your comfort zone of reading. Right now I'm reading a book called Jabbercrow, and that is— it's fiction. I really enjoy memoirs though. Just because I think there's something satisfying about reading of someone's extraordinary life. And yeah, knowing that it's, that it's real.

So lots of— yeah, I would say lots of memoirs. Poetry is hard for me. I wish I was someone that liked poetry, but yeah, there's— I can't get behind it.

Christian Solorzano [50:44]

There's a poetry foundation in Chicago. Have you been?

Suzie Shin [50:49]

I haven't been, but I do believe that Thirst used to do some design work for the Poetry Foundation.

Christian Solorzano [50:54]

Yeah, I think they did a few of their covers for their— yeah, they released these, I think, monthly poetry books. But they're— I mean, I would recommend you, like anyone listening, to go check out the Poetry Foundation in River North. It is just a beautiful building. It's just gorgeous. And they also offer, at least a few years ago, they probably still do this, but they had a lot of free workshops. And they're like workshops that are very like beginner-friendly, like introduction to XYZ.

And so I found myself appreciating poetry because of some of the workshops that I went there during the pandemic.

Suzie Shin [51:36]

Oh, wow. Were you always interested in writing?

Christian Solorzano [51:40]

Yeah, I've always been— I've always been into writing. Yeah, since I was a little kid. But it's only been like as of the last 5 years or so that I'm like actually writing and like sometimes calling myself a writer.

Suzie Shin [51:54]

Oh, wow. Yeah, very cool. I respect that a lot.

Christian Solorzano [51:58]

Yeah, it's fun most of the time, except when it's not. So I have a few like rapid-fire questions. So what are some things that you can't live without?

Suzie Shin [52:11]

Can't— rapid-fire. I honestly, the first thing that comes to mind is my laptop. I probably always have it around just because of the fear of what happens if you lost your laptop or if someone stole it. That's probably my worst nightmare.

Christian Solorzano [52:29]

Okay. Laptop. And what's your office must-have that is not your laptop? How do you, how do you, what's like paint a picture for us. What's your ideal working scenario ambiance?

Suzie Shin [52:45]

Yeah. Sunlight. I would say sunlight is probably the biggest part. I've always tried to create a studio space either in my house or my bedroom. Like I've had lots of versions of that, but I always end up coming out to work in the living room. Or just like anywhere near a window. I feel best that way.

Christian Solorzano [53:03]

Okay, cool. Anything else?

Suzie Shin [53:05]

It's— I need to be near a plug. Yeah. And that's it, I think.

Christian Solorzano [53:11]

So like an outlet, your laptop, and sun.

Suzie Shin [53:15]

Yeah, that's it, really. That's cool.

Christian Solorzano [53:19]

In Chicago, what are some of your favorite Chicago spots?

Suzie Shin [53:23]

Just like in general?

Christian Solorzano [53:25]

Yeah, just in general. If someone were to like run into you somewhere, what's like your— somewhere that you could always be found?

Suzie Shin [53:34]

Yeah, I absolutely love the Garfield Park Conservatory. It's one of my favorite places in the city, mostly because it's so beautiful and it's free. How can it get better? Yeah, actually, it can get better because it's right next to a train stop. So it hits the— it hits the top.

Christian Solorzano [53:56]

Yeah, and it's— it's— I love going there in the winter. Because it's not winter in there. Like a perfect escape. What makes you happy?

Suzie Shin [54:09]

What makes me happy? Making makes me happy. If I'm not— if I'm not making you can tell I'm really gloomy.

Christian Solorzano [54:21]

Yeah. And then what makes you angry?

Suzie Shin [54:24]

Oof. This might be a— I don't think it makes me look very good, but I really dislike AI at the moment. As someone who loves to make with my hands, as someone who loves to read, I do think AI has been upsetting me as of late.

Christian Solorzano [54:42]

Okay. Is it all forms of AI or?

Suzie Shin [54:48]

I think mostly with like creative writing or like reading the news. It feels like everything now that's in the news is written with AI.

And I would say, yeah, I think maybe the AI videos and images, just because I think it irks me that the conversation about copyright and like where all these images are being scraped from. Yeah, it almost feels like that's not the biggest fish to fry at the moment and people have moved on. Yeah, well, it did feel hot, like a hot topic for a second, like how can we continue training AI on stolen artwork? And now we're way beyond it.

Christian Solorzano [55:35]

Do you remember NFTs?

Suzie Shin [55:36]

Yeah.

Christian Solorzano [55:38]

Yeah, I feel like NFTs came and went. I've been— I use AI sometimes for like house things, like just general. Like for example, I took a photo of an AC once and I was like, can you tell me like what model this is and how I can fix it? Stuff like that. But I was using it to get feedback on stuff. You could like design or like writing and stuff.

And overall, like everything, the feedback was always positive. And I just, for a little while, I'm like, all right, AI likes it. I must be doing something right. And then I read an article about how AI was like turning people into narcissists because it was like conditioning them to believe that like they're just always right or that there's always something good about anything that they're asking. And since then I canceled my subscription and I like don't use AI for any kind of feedback thing.

Suzie Shin [56:37]

Yeah. It seems like it just can't capture that nuance. Whereas it's, it is great for those kind of just tasks or things that you would've Googled, but.

Christian Solorzano [56:50]

Yeah. But it's fun for other things. I've been using AI with Rick. To create images and I just look at it as a play. Like we're not— Like the idea is still there. There's still like a creative idea there and we're just trying to see if this thing could live up to our standard. And sometimes it does and sometimes it doesn't. So. But yes, that's—

Suzie Shin [57:14]

I'm certainly a traditionalist. I'm gonna be one of those people 30 years later. I hated it when AI came out and I still hate it. And I'm yeah. I'm just way behind on the times. Maybe.

Christian Solorzano [57:24]

There is a, there is a meme I saw and it was, and it was like a parent from the future and their kid was saying to them, you're so— 'cause like the child was trying to have a relationship with like an AI and the parent was like, no, a relationship is between 2 humans. And the kid was like, oh geez, mom, you're so like robophobic or something.

Suzie Shin [57:50]

So that'll be— We're headed that way for sure.

Christian Solorzano [57:55]

And then the other question that I had for you is just like any, aside from this exhibition, is there anything else that we should be on the lookout for or that you want to tease us with or what else is new?

Suzie Shin [58:09]

Yeah, I think I am aiming to make a bit of a transition. Away from graphic design and more so looking for what my next through line is with collage and perhaps a different medium like textiles. So, I would say I'm perhaps thinking about how I would present that pivot. Although I think there's also a lot of conflicting feelings I have with needing to document as something is happening. Versus letting what I make be documented later.

Just because it feels there's just too much pressure on here's what I'm going to do and here's how it's going and how do I have time to both make and document? I don't really know. So.

Christian Solorzano [59:01]

Yeah. Documenting, I feel like that's a whole job and you almost need someone to like follow you around and document it for you. And what is it about graphic design that you're trying, you're trying to break up with?

Suzie Shin [59:15]

I think it's probably been my experience with how graphic design feels more and more pushed towards marketing. Sometimes in a corporate setting, that's even synonymous. And I, yeah, I guess I don't want to be swept in that current. So I'm trying to swing the other way. Yeah, that's good.

Christian Solorzano [59:38]

I feel the same way. Yeah, we're on the same wavelength in that regard. I think—

Suzie Shin [59:43]

Which I'll be— oh, go ahead.

Christian Solorzano [59:45]

No, I'm saying I was gonna like— I think a lot of people are, but yeah.

Suzie Shin [59:50]

Yeah, no, I feel that other people are feeling that way too. But when you swing all the way to the other side, would I be introducing myself as a fine artist? I'm not sure. So I do feel somewhere in between like the commercial world and lightly into the art world.

Christian Solorzano [60:10]

Yeah. Cool. I look forward to seeing what you, what you do and I'll be looking out for the documentation that happens after you do the thing.

Suzie Shin [60:21]

Yeah, it'll be in like 5 years, I think.

Christian Solorzano [60:24]

Very cool. It was great speaking with you and I'm so glad that we connected and I hope that we run into each other at the Paul sometime because you're teaching in the, in the afternoons, right?

Suzie Shin [60:37]

Yeah, I think it'll be maybe 10 to 1.

Christian Solorzano [60:42]

Okay, so I'm in the evening, so we probably won't run into each other, but—

Suzie Shin [60:46]

Ships in the night.

Christian Solorzano [60:48]

Yes, but cool. And if anyone wants to get a hold of you, what's the best way for people to reach out, to connect with you?

Suzie Shin [60:56]

I haven't posted anything on Instagram like 2 years. But I probably check it more frequently than anything else. So if they just message me, I will 100% read it. And if it's reasonable, I respond. Yeah.

Christian Solorzano [61:13]

The people that never post on Instagram always seem to be like the coolest people.

Suzie Shin [61:19]

Or no, in my case, I'm just a lurker. I lurk around. I know what's happening, but I just can't be— I can't be bothered to post anything.

Christian Solorzano [61:32]

Very cool. Well, thanks so much. Yep, this is a great conversation. And for everyone that's listening, definitely check out the exhibition opening mid-August.

Suzie Shin [61:44]

Yeah, mid-August is right.

Christian Solorzano [61:50]

And that exhibition runs through— when does it close?

Suzie Shin [61:54]

Early November.

Christian Solorzano [61:55]

Okay, so people have time. Awesome. Thank you so much.

Suzie Shin [62:01]

Yes, thank you so much, Christian.

Christian Solorzano [62:03]

All right, peace out.